Duratec clutch bleed

[moosetestbestanden]

The clutch pedal's been going soft, not returning full travel so I want to bleed the thing. Bleed nipple is on top of the bell housing and while I can get a wrench on it there's no room to turn it.

Scott E, got any pointers?

[Elv15]

beeding the clutch

Chris,

Can you post a pic of your setup? I have something similar, but yours may vary enough for my advice to not work for you.

Can you use a brake flare wrench? I've seen some of these that have an offset.

Cheers,

Tom

[Blacksport350]

Is it a 6-speed? If it is and you have a pic, I just did a bleed on mine and may be able to give some advice.

Aside from the bleed nipple, it is an easy system to deal with. After you pull the cover to the pedal box off, you can actuate the clutch pedal with your hand while you open and close the bleeder! I did a manual pump and bleed but used my vacuum bleeder on the nipple anyway as I didn't want any fluid going into my bell housing.

[JohnCh]

Chris, I just did this yesterday, but it sounds like I have a little more room than you have in your setup so could use a very small box end wrench. Is there anything over the bleed nipple? If not, then crack it open with a socket and a long extension. Once it is cracked open, you only need to rotate it about 1/8 of a turn to bleed, so keep it open a little and place a collection tube on top of the nipple. I used a Motive Power Bleeder pumped to 4-5psi and then ran a little fluid through until the bubbles disappeared. Once that happened, I simply opened the power bleeder to release the pressure, removed the collection tube, and tightened the bleed nipple.

-John

[moosetestbestanden]

Can you use a brake flare wrench? I've seen some of these that have an offset.

I'll have to look that up to see what it is. It requires a 5/8" spanner ((English English - I'm still practicing:D) but the problem is that mine are too long to get enough turn angle to properly loosen / tighten the thing.

I'll post a pic after work when I get home. I reckon mine is like yours Tom - it extends out of the top of the bell housing just behind the "distributor" (such as they are nowadays).

John: Thanks:)

I took the master cylinder out yesterday evening to see if it was the culprit (it was sorta 'popping' on actuation when operated by hand after disconnecting from the pedal) and found a bunch of crusty balls (about 1mm dia +/-) of fluid in the reservoir [boingy bug-eyed emoticon thing]. Once removed the plunger felt and sounded ok (many years ago I rebuilt sooo many English Car M.C.s & slaves that I was thinking of opening Bill King's Slave-o as a business).

So, I decided I'll bleed the thing to see if that puts things right before purchasing any re-build kits ($19.95 at Pegasus Racing) or a new M.C. ($98.95 at the same place) or if something's gone wrong Down In There, which would be both major surgery [2nd bigger boingy bug-eyed emoticon thing] and a major pita w/ my schedule of work and track events. Bleah.

[moosetestbestanden]

Photo 1 shows the position of the bleed nipple w/ bleed tube, just below the water temp. sensor.

Photo 2 is a crow's foot wrench, er, spanner that should do the trick.

[Elv15]

Chris,

Your setup looks identical to mine. There is a long pipe coming from the hydraulic actuator up to the bleed nipple. Make SURE that you don't turn the whole pipe when you loosen the bleed nipple.

Also, you might think about a bit of wire screen over that hole - to keep stray bolts/rocks/etc out of the bellhousing.

[Elv15]

OH, and one other item you need to be aware of - these particular actuators have a limited range of movement. If you exceed their range - the actuator will burst!! :eek:

I set mine very carefully to only use as much pedal travel as necessary to engage/disengage the clutch.

[moosetestbestanden]

No fluid can move through the system, w/ the bleed nipple open (as near as I can tell). Bummer.

Master cylinder piston rubber hydraulic seal looks ok but there is some (for lack of a better term) baked-on schmutz in the cylinder itself. We used to hone that kind of shit out but I don't have that tool anymore. Besides, I really doubt that it is sufficiently schmutzy to be causing my problem. More crystallized fluid bits showed up, one as big as 1/8" diameter. Blockage is a possibility but the only way to determine that is to pull the braided steel line, which means...

It looks like engine out time. I was hoping to do this a little later this summer, and for much much better reason. Barring a miracle (like a winning lottery ticket) I'm f****d for sure on Buttonwillow mid-June and likely Infineon as well, on account of the time pressures from my frickin job. Double Bummer.

Scott, you still got the hoist?

[slomove]

Commiserations.....by the way it is "schmutzig" (proper German) not "schmutzy" (Germlisch). I know..you know that.

But, to be serious, if time is the major issue here I know a rather good mechanic in Pasadena who could do such a routine job at reasonable cost. He might need some clues about the intricacies of a Duratec-in-a-Caterham installation.

That means if you would trust such a heavy handed guy with your baby....

Gert

[moosetestbestanden]

So I'm shooting a little craps w/ a new MC to arrive tomorrow. If that doesn't work it's hoist away, likely Sunday.

Tom: Is there any to know if the acutator is turning w/ the nipple? Initial cracking of the thing was kind of tight but it loosens and tightens now, seemingly normal. Do you have photos posted on pierats by any chance?

Gert: Thanks (for the grammar too:D). I may call.

[Elv15]

Hi Chris,

Sorry, it's not the actuator that turns, but the long pipe that connects the nipple to the actuator. Here is a pic: http://pierats.com/gallery/sevenbuild/res42446?full=1

The nipple that you turn has two ends
- one that actually has the male bleed nipple on it (that you connect to your clear bleed hose)
- the other end is female (pipe thread I believe)

The female end fits over a pipe that goes down to the slave cylinder (which is in the middle of the bellhousing). The danger is if the pipe turns with the nipple, thereby not actually opening the bleed nipple, but backing the pipe out of the actuator. It is simply a matter of watching the pipe when you turn the bleed nipple. If you see the pipe turn - that is bad! I had this happen and had to tighten the pipe (it worked for me to simply tighten it using the bleed nipple). Once the pipe was tight I was able to back off the bleed nipple.

[moosetestbestanden]

Thanks Tom. I sussed that out last night at Scott's house when I went to pick up the hoist and had a look at his (unfortunately still) dismantled engine n gearbox. That is exactly what was happening and fully explains why no fluid was moving through. I pretty well pegged the duh-o-meter this time, although in my own defense I had never seen inside the bell housing and didn't really know the configuration internally until last night.

I'm making another run at it this afternoon when I get home from work. Fingers crossed - I really would rather not pull the engine (just yet:D).

[moosetestbestanden]

Sorted :cool: