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Anyone dyno'd a Duratec?

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  • Anyone dyno'd a Duratec?

    Any of you 2.3 Duratec owners have a decent map for your MBE 976 ECU? Better yet. Anyone been on a dyno?

    Scott

  • #2
    duratec

    I have a map for a 2.0L I can send you a copy or perhaps Magnus can flie such things somewhere on the site here.

    It has not been on a dyno...yet.:wink:

    Tom
    Tom "ELV15" Jones
    http://PIErats.com

    Comment


    • #3
      That's actually quite a good idea. I am more than willing to post maps (with absolutely no responsibility from my or anyone else's side) on this site.

      Each map should, from the top of my head, by accompanied by the following information (if available)

      ECU make and model (and maybe software revision)
      Engine year, type and displacement.
      Cams
      Compression
      Intake system
      Injector size
      Valves (if modified)
      Other info

      The only issue would be some obscure copyright issue if we would (by accident) post a map developed/owned by someone else.

      Any intellectual property experts out there?

      /Magnus F.

      Comment


      • #4
        I received a couple form Emerald, one of which I am using with some modifications as my baseline map. I'll ask Karl if it is okay to post those.

        Tom, I'd love to see a copy of your map. Will you send that to me?

        Thanks,
        John
        Westfield SEiW
        2.0L Duratec
        Throttle Steer

        Comment


        • #5
          The Emerald is a different ECU from the MBE isn't it?

          I know the ECU in my car (MBE) has a label stating 'Ford Coolant Input', which separates it from other MBE engine applications I believe.

          MY 2.0L seems to be mapped pretty well, but I've never looked at it. My bloody (oooo! English English) VIAO notebook died just before everything started running. I sense a slight problem in 1 cylinder but have yet to be able to plug in to have a look.

          In conversations w/ Will he indicated that the maps those fellas make are pretty good right out o the box. As all of this is a black art to me, one that I have yet to delve into. But I'm ready so keep this thread going! Maybe a session in someone's Duratec garage is in order.
          Chris
          ------------
          A day you don't go a hundred is a day wasted

          Comment


          • #6
            ECU tweaking

            Before you tweak anything you need a wideband 02 meter. Then you need a dyno or at the very least a g-tech onboard computer/dyno. You do _not_ want to make mod's to the maps without these tools.

            I did modify the ECU to use the radiator fan output to drive the electric thermostat on the duratec, but this is not really tuning.

            Tom
            Tom "ELV15" Jones
            http://PIErats.com

            Comment


            • #7
              Yes, the Emerald is different from the MBE, but some folks in the States are using it. The nice thing about the Emerald map is that you can open it using Notepad and see the injection and ignition tables. I doubt the injection table is much use to non-Emerald users other than determining a percentage change in fueling at different load/rpm settings, but the ignition map should be very relevant (ignition readings in Notepad are stored at double their actual values, so you need to divide these by 2 to calculate the actual advance).

              Echoing Tom's advice, a Wide band O2 sensor is a must for tuning. I am using the Innovate Motorpsorts unit which integrates with the Emerald's internal data logging capability, but also has its own data logging functionality for ECUs that don't offer this feature.

              -John
              Westfield SEiW
              2.0L Duratec
              Throttle Steer

              Comment


              • #8
                I can warmly second the value of a wideband sensor. I have one permanently hooked up to my ECU (Pectel T6).

                The injection map is very valuable, even if you cant transfer the exact values (which will be useless anyway as soon as fuel pressure or injector sizes varies).

                Off the top of my head, I would to the following:

                DISCLAIMER: I take no responsibility if you damage your engine following the procedure below. An incorrect map will induce knocking, which will kill your Zetec engine IMMEDIATELY. You have been warned.

                Make a note of your injector map values in the idling area.

                Save the old map.

                Type in the new map, and set the idling area to the same values you have in the old map. As you continue to enter the values, use the idling area as a reference point and add the percentage difference for the different cells.

                Start the car, do NOT put the engine under load.

                With a wideband lambda sensor plugged in, carefully drive up and down the road and check that the lambda value doesn't go above 0.87-0.89 (or whatever value you deem safe) under load.

                If things start to lean out (high lambda values) under load, get off the throttle at once and raise the entire map a few percent.

                Please note that during overrun (engine braking) things lean out to above 1.00, which is OK. What we are trying to avoid is knocking during load, which will break stock Zetec rods in less than a second.

                Repeat until you are happy.

                Occasionally check that your injectors don't max out (fire continously), which may happen if you are running stock injectors with an engine that breathes a lot of air.

                /Magnus F.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Any dyno/tuners in the Orange Couny area? My 2.3 duratech was dynoed and tuned, but way up near San Francisco, but I didn't get any numbers.

                  It would be nice to at least get the numbers, and maybe some more tuning. Car is running ok, but fuel milage is around 15mpg, so I'm guessing it's running a bit rich.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    My car was recently dyno'd up in Vacaville as well and the car came back as I'd hoped. My mileage is now 25-28 miles per gallon. Range, on a full tank, is now equal to the amount of time I can sit in the car for a non stop drive. Anything more would require me to get out, stretch, and cool off the feet.
                    The car runs hotter now. Had a problem with the fan coming on. Pulled it out and tested it partially submerged in a pot of water on the stove. It worked fine. More snooping found an air pocket at the top of the radiator where the switch resides. I opened the hole at the top of the rad. and filled from the overflow tank. Fan works fine now.
                    A special 'thankyou' goes out to Elv15 for supplying me with a spare male 13 pin AMP connector. I'd been running with the pins merely placed into the female end. Thanks Tom.
                    A good proper alignment will have the car ready for the track. As for myself... I won't know till I try.
                    New plates, too. BECENG U.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I took the car to a dyno shop myself. Hitting rev-limiter at 7200rpm, well below power peak. Might even be too much duration, won't be sure until the ECU gets programmed again. Also it's running too rich from about 3,000 to 4,500. The fuel air sensor got blown out of the exhaust pipe at 6700 rpm, which is why it goes up and away.

                      Since then, I got a new exhaust, 2.5 inch pipe with a Magnaflow muffler. Waiting for another ECU map update.




                      [/img]

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The torque curve clearly shows the dip at 3.5-4.0K,which you should be able to adjust yourself without going back to the dyno.

                        If you can get a graphic display of your injection map in your mapping software, that area should show up as a clear bump which you can probably smoothen out.

                        For reference, here is my current injection map (image is in my personal gallery). Sorry about the coloring.

                        http://www.californiacaterhamclub.co...c.php?pic_id=6

                        The fuel timing's sharp rise in the upper right corner is due to us trying to compensate for a lean (0.93) condition until we found out that the injectors were maxing out.

                        The only adjustment that I will make to this map is to lean out overrun, where I engine brake. Right now I get powersurges from too much gas as I engine brake my way down through the cells at the bottom of the map (closest to the RPM axle arrow).

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Also, don't forget the most obvious reason for a badly running engine:

                          http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2005062919,00.html

                          /Magnus F.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hi Guys,

                            Some observations here:

                            These A/F ratio numbers are not particularly rich, and are in fact, a bit lean for our liking over most of the range. Most dyno operators today (especially ones involved with smog testing) are used to numbers that have evolved as a means to allow catalytic converters to function properly, not neccessarily that give best power. Since the O2 sensor fell out toward the end of the pull, you can assume that it was loose and in process of falling out earlier in the run. Thus it is best to ignore any of the mixture numbers recorded. It is very important to avoid chasing your tail trying to "correct" mapping issues born of spurious data. Also note that different O2 sensor systems frequently give different readings and it is dangerous to compare readings from different systems too closly without first establishing your own baseline.

                            Re: the 3500 dip in the torque curve. It is highly unlikely you will be able to tune that out, as it is mainly a product of intake ram tuning characteristics peculiar to the runner length common to most individual throttle body set-ups on Se7ens. We get the same dip on the Zetecs, and can demonstrate the condition on some pretty sophisticated engine computer modeling software we use. If you want to drive fast you'll be above that rev range anyway, right? To get rid of the dip, consider the stock Focus inlet manifold length. Did I hear someone suggest really mild cams?.........Naah.

                            Maybe this is a all fodder for the tech seminar.

                            Cheers,
                            Woody

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              You still planning on coming down to OC in September, Woody? I'm going through Caterham withdrawal symptoms again, it's been a couple of months since I last drove it. William installed a new cam with more lift and less duration, put in Honda valve guides and new rods. Should be good for 8000 rpm now, but hoping power peak occurs below that with th new cam.

                              I've posted some pics of my Caterham here:

                              http://jeffareid.net/ctm/ctm.htm

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